Ideal fixed player level?

[FiftyTifty]

One of my unreleased projects for Fallout 4, is a complete overhaul of the game's difficulty. Everything is level 50, including the player, and every weapon's damage is jacked up in accordance to their tiers, with each teir having a minimal difference in damage. Armour has the same boost as the weapons; DR is raised and the difference between tiers being minimal increases in resistance.

It completely changes the game, turning a borefest of a game into a hellish environment that wants to eat the player at every turn.

Now I want to do this for New Vegas, and eventually, TTW 3.0. But I haven't played in ages, and really don't want to do another couple months of testing. So, some input is needed.

What is the ideal player level? As in, where you have just gotten enough points to flesh out your build, but not anywhere close to becoming a Mary Sue who can repair, hack, shoot, spray and explode with impunity. I'm thinking level 20; one major skill (80-100), two minor skills (~65), and five accessory skills (~40). The max allowed by the game is, what, 45? But at that point, you're running maxed stats and nothing is difficult. Which is wank.

[Nostalgia]

With the skill books? I'd say level 12 is fun for me. The reason is because it's a nice intermediate level where tougher enemies are appearing and punishing you if you haven't invested in any combat skills and/or survival, medicine. Personally, I retextured the skill books and don't even use them- I collect them instead. At this level, you still need every magazine, chem, food, or drink you can find to survive the tougher fights and situations. Once you approach lvl 20, the game gets somewhat easier. After level 20 it is just a slugfest between you and enemies most of the time. But, I don't think I would like to be locked into a level. I make the experience needed for leveling much, much higher- and it's been more challenging and fun so far. I find that having to work much harder to level makes it that much more rewarding when you do.

[FiftyTifty]

[quote=Nostalgia]

 

With the skill books? I'd say level 12 is fun for me. The reason is because it's a nice intermediate level where tougher enemies are appearing and punishing you if you haven't invested in any combat skills and/or survival, medicine. Personally, I retextured the skill books and don't even use them- I collect them instead. At this level, you still need every magazine, chem, food, or drink you can find to survive the tougher fights and situations. Once you approach lvl 20, the game gets somewhat easier. After level 20 it is just a slugfest between you and enemies most of the time. But, I don't think I would like to be locked into a level. I make the experience needed for leveling much, much higher- and it's been more challenging and fun so far. I find that having to work much harder to level makes it that much more rewarding when you do.

[/quote]

The books are another mechanic I'll neuter. They will provide minor buffs, like the science books giving +1DR against energy weapons.

The reason for level locking, is to get rid of that bullet sponge bullshit. That, and having content being level gated is utter tripe. Rather than having enemies be level locked, instead, have them all spawn with the difference between their tiers also being minimal.

Leveling systems are an archaic holdover from the 80's, and they need to be removed. Already did it for Fallout 4, and now I'm doing it for New Vegas.

[jlf65]

I wind up collecting magazines/books as well, but because I never have the one I need when I need it! "I could really really use a lockpick magazine right now... guns, energy weapons, melee, NOPE! Don't have a god-damned one - again!"

I'll have six or seven of ones I never use, but ones I COULD use are few and far between, and I tend to pick them up after I really could have used it.

[FiftyTifty]

I've made some surprising progress over the past two days; overhauled the damage of all weapons, and am almost finished with the AR and DT values for every piece of clothing and armour in new Vegas. The .357 revolver, for instance, has a base damage of 50. Clothes were adjusted to the following categories:

[b]

Type - DT / AR



Glasses - 0 / 0



Hat - 1 / 0



Clothes - 3 / 10



Leather Clothes - 4 / 10



Hazmat Suit - 6 / 10



Light Armour - 12 / 15



Light Helmet - 3 / 0



Stealth Suit - 14 / 18



Stealth Helmet - 4 / 6



Medium Armour - 17 / 23



Medium Helmet - 5 / 0



Heavy Armor - 21 / 30



Heavy Helmet - 7 / 0



Power Armour Helmet - 10 / 15



Power Armour - 32 / 45

[/b]

DT would be too overpowered at these high damage values, so I had to mix in a hefty amount of AR.

[Garfink]

I would say level 30, I am using vicious waste gameplay overhaul mod and it is capped at level 30 and it is a good level allowing for player customization but with limitations.  You'll be surprised, with all the skill books, bobble heads and perks you can get your stats up pretty high, but its never overpowered and you could play the whole game (FO3 and FO NV) as level 30 and it will work fine.

It also means things like magazines and armors that give you a stat boost becomes essential to collect and use.  Also level 30 and perks at every level is necessary if you are using the "more perks" mod.  (why wouldn't you use it LOL?)  Also there is the added benefit of many DLC/Quest Mods that recommend a minimum level of 30, so that is a thing to consider.)

[Risewild]

If a player uses Perks Every Level mod, then I would say that the "ideal player level" is 15. Getting perks every level is really OP. At level 15 you will get as many "level up" perks as you would at level 30 with the vanilla game.

[FiftyTifty]

I did some experimenting, and found 25 with New Vegas' default of one perk every two levels. You get enough points to have one or two major skills, and five or so minor skills. So you can be a gunner lockpicker, or a charismatic brawler, but you can't be a Mary Sue.

Balancing the creatures is going to be a major pain in the ass. Human NPCs were easy to balance; just set them all to level 25.

[FiftyTifty]

FiftyTifty, but I haven't any FO3/FNV mods uploaded. Made a few for TTW in the past, and am still waiting on 3.0 to come out before I get back into it.