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The First Train Ride cost from DC to NV in TTW

General discussion of Tale of Two Wastelands
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Decker
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The First Train Ride cost from DC to NV in TTW

Post by Decker » Thu Nov 27, 2014 11:54 am

Just got to thinking about how it would make more sense for the first train ride from DC to NV cost a lot more than any subsequent train rides back and forth. Rationale here being that 200 years after the Great War, rail lines would be in poor repair at several places and it is very likely that scavengers would have removed some of the relevant rail track sections for their own projects during the centuries - So, the first train ride would need additional expenses to be paid, finally something substantial to spend some of that fortune of bottlecaps acquired during the capital wasteland storyline (my characters on most playthroughs - on hardcore/very hard - are often bottlecap millionaires by the time they get through most Capital Wasteland quests).


These first time additional expenses could include having to hire an entire scavenger team to repair/replace rail track sections by scavenging other rail lines not in use (this could take months or more), as well as a capable merc outfit (like frex Reilly's Rangers) to protect the whole operation from the dangers in between the two wastelands. Also, equipment, tools, spare parts, ammo for mercs and consumables for everyone for the hirelings would add costs. Requiring at least 10 000 caps (perhaps even 100 000 caps or more, or alternatively a sizable fraction of total caps owned by the Lone Wanderer) of extra payment for the first train ride (to properly establish the rail line connection) would seem perfectly reasonable. This extra cost would not be necessary on any subsequent train rides (which would have the usual costs of tickets), because the DC-NV rail line operation would have become self-sufficient by then (9 years later) and would be ran by someone other than the Courier 6/Lone Wanderer.


I don't really know that much about mod-making, but implementing an option of extra cost for the first train ride with a bit of explanatory text propably would not need much work - Just one extra text message box with explanation and a choice to either pay the extra cost to fix the rail line to full operational status in order to make the first journey or do nothing and leave (And this extra message box would only appear for the first journey). As for why to implement an option like this, I think it would add immersion and perhaps even a certain sense of accomplishment for the player to see the Lone Wanderer's hard earned wealth to have such a direct impact on the gameworld of TTW.


Of course, this is just my personal opinion, I think that the first journey is perhaps a bit too easily affordable. What do you all think would be the best way to assign costs for TTWs first train ride?


 


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Risewild
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To me the train rides should

Post by Risewild » Thu Nov 27, 2014 1:29 pm

To me the train rides should be paid in pre-war money laugh 200 years ago there was no caps as a currency, the station in DC has been sealed since the bombs fell down, so it would make sense the tickets cost pre-war money cheeky.


About the first time the cost being higher so that it can repair tracks and stuff, well future plans for TTW is to have stops between DC and the Mojave (I am not entirely sure if they will be one time visits or be like DLC locations that the player can keep returning to if (s)he wish) and the first time one get to those stops it will be for reasons like repairing the tracks, repairing the train or other reasons (like the tracks are blocked by a band of train robbers or any other reason). So in the future the player might have to repair the tracks himself or help people repairing them so having that message popup saying it is more expensive for those reasons and then have to repair the stuff himself would not make much sense.


And to be honest the first ride is actually free cheeky there is a free ticket in the office where one can activate the protectron in the DC station...


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Decker
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If indeed it is an automated

Post by Decker » Thu Nov 27, 2014 2:58 pm

If indeed it is an automated pre-war system, then yes, pre-war money sounds reasonable for purchasing tickets. However, how many units of pre-war money it should cost is a bit unclear - One unit of pre-war money seems to be a whole wad of cash. In previous discussions questions seem to have been raised as to whether or not all banknotes in the wad of cash are usable - IMHO unusable banknotes (damaged beyond recognition) would have been discarded right then and there when the player character loots the pre-war money from safes, cashier machines and whatnot - Only usable items appear in the containers via the player interface. My guess would be that considering the pre-war inflation levels, one unit of pre-war money would likely be a wad of $20+ banknotes, frex 50x$20=$1000 per 1 ingame unit of pre-war money - This seems to be a plausible estimate based on the (low) amounts of pre-war money units found from safes or cashiers machines. Considering the high inflation rate, I'd find it much more likely to find massive amounts of higher nomination banknotes in circulation, as opposed to lots of only $1 nomination bills.


From a practical viewpoint, pre-war money is extremely limited in-game currently, I have been buying and looting every pre-war money unit I can find in the game (weightless currency is nice to have in Hardcore mode), my current character in TTW2.7.2 playthrough (nearing the end of Capital Wasteland main storyline) is way beyond level 50 and only has aquired a bit over 200 units of pre-war money as compared to about two and a half million of profits in bottlecaps - Guesstimating from these numbers it would seem that Pre-war Money is actually three or four orders of magnitude harder (up to 10 000 times rarer) to get in the game (on DC side) currently than bottlecaps (mostly due pre-war money unit scarcity as a loot item, or limited amounts and chances to buy it from vendors with caps). It is possible to get tons of pre-war money from the Sierra Madre DLC, but that takes place only after the first railroad trip, 9 years after the Lone Wanderer leaves the Capital Wasteland.


I for one am very glad to hear that additional content is planned as stops on the rail line for TTW, this sounds great. New worldspaces and new stuff to do, very nice.


But getting back to the topic here, free (or low cost) ticket is IMHO a bit too easy gameplay-wise to simply just up and go on a cross-continental ride in a post-nuke world 200 years after the bomb, especially on the first trip. Before the extra TTW content of railroad stops is added, perhaps a simple interim solution would be possible to add more bottlecap cost to the first trip? .. If I understand correctly, it would be equally simple to remove this plugged in extra-cost text box when the extra content is made available?


This first trip only extra cost would be in bottlecaps (in addition to pre-war money for train tickets), because caps is what one would pay to Capital Wasteland hirelings and/or merchants/mercs. The extra cost would not buy a ticket, but would make it possible to actually use the tickets ingame. The extra cost text box could be applied for example on Train Engine door(s) - It would not be possible to get inside the Train Engine to use a ticket before the extra cost is paid to fix the rail line. After the extra cost is paid once, the train tickets (free or bought) could be used as usual.


 



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Risewild
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The thing with us the TTW

Post by Risewild » Fri Nov 28, 2014 7:35 am

The thing with us the TTW team is that if someone wants to go to New Vegas as soon as it gets out of the vault 101, then it can do so, that is why there is one and only one free ticket in the DC station. We even already had people saying that they would prefer not to have to make the quest to open the blast doors so they could enter the train tracks easier and faster (although we made it so even low level characters can do it with a bit of exploring). There is not just one kind of player and for now TTW tries to be convenient to most types of players we can (it is impossible to accommodate all the types of player out there, but if we could we would).


There is also external mods, for example if one plays with a survival and scavenger mod setup where everything is scarcer and/or merchants pay very little for whatever we sell them and charge a lot for even the most basic of things (TJ's PANZER mod comes to mind for example) then they would never have such amount of caps as someone that plays with a lot of fancy weapons and stuff mods that they can find several and sell them and get rich quick.


But rest assured, the price for the tickets are still just a kind of placeholder for the moment, again like I said there are plans to improve and add to the train ride in the future, and then will be when the team will have to discuss all of this stuff and decide, although it will still take a while for that.


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Decker
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I do understand the

Post by Decker » Fri Nov 28, 2014 10:49 am

I do understand the importance of catering for several different player types at the same time; what I really meant here was having an optional little extra plugin for TTW that would add the text box for extra bottlecap cost - Something entirely optional and easy to remove. That is the real strength of the mods I think, each and every individual player can fairly easily use mods to customize their game more to their liking and preferences.


 



JaxFirehart
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What you are asking is

Post by JaxFirehart » Fri Nov 28, 2014 4:21 pm

What you are asking is incredibly simple and would be an excellent first mod (assuming you don't have any modding experience alread).


Read up on some tutorials and take a crack at it, ask questions here when you get stuck. So long as you appear to be trying on your own before asking for help everyone here is super helpful.



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Puppettron
Gary
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we usually start with sarcasm

Post by Puppettron » Fri Nov 28, 2014 5:05 pm

we usually start with sarcasm though, just so you're aware.


perms:  either a full fireworks display spelling out "Puppettron Made This" anytime a user accesses my content in-game, or just give me credit somewhere.

paragonskeep
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Puppettron wrote:

Post by paragonskeep » Sat Nov 29, 2014 2:17 am

[quote=Puppettron]


 


we usually start with sarcasm though, just so you're aware.


[/quote]


Who does that?!?!?


If life is but a test, where's the damn answer key?!?!?

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Risewild
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I think Puppettron means me,

Post by Risewild » Sat Nov 29, 2014 2:46 am

I think Puppettron means me, on this part:



To me the train rides should be paid in pre-war money 200 years ago there was no caps as a currency, the station in DC has been sealed since the bombs fell down, so it would make sense the tickets cost pre-war money .



But who knows.


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chucksteel
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I originally had the transit

Post by chucksteel » Sat Nov 29, 2014 7:00 am

I originally had the transit rate a lot higher then it is now! I got out voted and humbly agree with the decision! A hight cost would break TTW's mission statemnt and diverge from our intent. 


I agree with Jax this would make a good first mod. If you need help feel free to PM me and I'll try my best to help! 



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