[quote=dandys]
What if we changed Lincoln's repeater and/or the point lookout lever-action rifle to use .32 as well? That would create more uses for it (10mm and .44 magnum already are used enough by other weapons) and that might be further motivation to keep the ammo.
[/quote]
Definitely not, if we can find a decent way for .32 to stand on its own then I will agree to keep it, but we shouldn't start changing other guns any more than is necessary.
[quote=steviestevens]
My biggest problem with no .32 is low level raider tearing you up with .308 hunting rifles. Also it kinda takes away how nice ol painless was, it was a good low level rifle/sniper and even with the right build a downright dangerous weapon...
[/quote]
Low level raiders wouldn't get .308 hunting rifles, they would get weapons that are appropriate for their levels such as 9mm pistols, assault rifles and the like.
[quote=steviestevens]
I do see how it is pointless on having 2 versions of the rifle, but if u dont add hunting rifles into level lists until later it will make having anythign but weak pistols an problem for a while... I think the issue of not having a rifle without adding in the varmit rifle (which im kind of against) would be a problem.
[/quote]
While I understand the hesitance on the varmint rifle, I don't think it is inappropriate. Even if it is, the Service Rifle is a decent low level alternative.
[quote=yukichigai]
it would throw off ammo balance dramatically. Since the Varmint Rifle runs off of 5.56, you'd get a wealth of that ammo on low levels, where in vanilla FO3 most players had to wait for about level 8-10 before 5.56 weapons became really maintainable.
[/quote]
While I want to keep FO3 as close to original as possible, we need to include the upgrades and tweaks supplied by FNV. FNV changed the prevalence of 5.56mm, it is available from the start of the game (varmint rifle) and through to the end of the game (marksman carbine). FNV made 5.56 the most common ammo type. Even if we don't include the varmint rifle, there is still the service rifle.
[quote=yukichigai]
That also doesn't handle the issue of Super Mutants, who can use the .32 HR but NOT the Varmint Rifle. That would, again, be a drastic change we might not want to make.
[/quote]
Super mutants can use the assault rifle at low levels and grow into hunting rifles and chinese assault rilfes as the player levels up.
[quote=yukichigai]
Why couldn't we have two hunting rifles? They are decidedly not identical, other than appearance. The damage, fire rate, accuracy, recoil, and ammunition are all different. So we have to rename them to indicate the difference between the two. Doesn't seem like much of a big deal. And honestly it's the ONLY viable option I can see here. .308 is too goddamn powerful in the CW to be handing out to low-level enemies like Wastelanders and SuperMutants. The Varmint Rifle cannot be put in because 1) SuperMutants can't use it (check the weapon list), and 2) it would make 5.56mm ammo too abundant and available too early in an environment that heavily emphasizes 5.56mm automatic weapons.
Seriously, I really am having trouble understanding why having two different-caliber Hunting Rifles is a big problem. Am I missing something? I'm just not seeing any problem with this other than there would be two of one type of weapon, which might be slightly confusing but otherwise fine. This, versus dramatically altering the balance of the whole game to consolidate them.
[/quote]
I NEVER have suggested just handing out the .308 hunting rifle at low levels. The super mutants don't NEED to be able to use the varmint rifle, they have the assault rifle they can use. It doesn't have the range of the hunting rifle, but SM had terrible accuracy anyway. Don't forget that there were super mutants in FNV, so the game designers must have already created a balance somehow. I have already addressed the ammo change, so I won't repeat myself. Having two different hunting rifles is a problem because our choice is to inject a brand new weapon and work it into the game, or balance around the fact that the Hunting Rifle was upgraded. The first option requires creating a new injected record, restructuring the leveled lists, and changing item placement versus the second option which is just restructuring the leveled lists. Let's say we create a new weapon, the .32 hunting rifle, and reskin it what do we call it? I think calling it ".32 Hunting Rifle" and ".308 Hunting Rifle" is tacky. So we have to come up with a new name, no big deal. So now we have a gun that doesn't look like the standard hunting rifle, has a different name and has a different formid. It's basically a different gun now. So now we have added a completely new gun rather than working around the fact that they upgraded the original gun in FNV. Creating a brand new weapon isn't our job. We need to work with what we have.
