NV Does Not Start After Train & Overlapping Super Mutant Textures

Post by **Sarcasm** » Wed May 28, 2014 11:18 am

From what I can tell, it is the MMM conversion causing this. I always back up my install before installing any major new mod, and I started up my pre-MMM TTW backup and the textures display fine. Anyone have an idea how mods like MMM handle textures and how I could tell the game to have MMM ignore FNV super mutant textures? Or if that is even possible?

When applying a conflict filter in FNVEdit, I get a bunch of "unused data" warnings, all of which reference super mutants. Could these be related in any way? For some reason I can't make spoilers anymore so the warnings are listed here.

Post by TJ » Wed May 28, 2014 12:23 pm

Dude - You're spending alot of time guessing and blaming mods. MMM probably didn't cause this - as you are well aware it doesn't even use the same folder as NV Super Mutants. Move your Texture folder and verify game cache. Then start over. Either check each Texture before you add it back in, or download new texture packs.

Post by **Sarcasm** » Wed May 28, 2014 2:58 pm

I never thought of diagnosing mod conflicts as placing blame somewhere, just trying to solve a problem. Like I said before, deleting textures from the MMM folder was affecting the textures on the FNV super mutants, so the two are clearly connected. Also, the texture pack I use shouldn't have anything to do with this since NMC does not affect enemies or NPCs, only landscape and objects. Uninstalling NMC had no effect, either.

I took my archived installation as it was before I installed MMM or any texture packs, where the super mutant textures were fine, and installed MMM on it. The textures are now overlapping there just as they are in my main install. So it's obviously MMM. It must not be getting along with something I have.

With MMM installed, when I rename my textures folder and Verify Cache, I get FNV super mutants with half missing textures as in my above screenshots. Putting the other textures and folders in didn't change anything other than restoring the half-FO3 textures on the mutants when I put MMMFO3's textures back in.

I'm going to take my pre-MMM install again and install MMM folder by folder or even file by file if that's what I have to do, so I can find out exactly what file or files are doing this.

Post by **Sarcasm** » Wed May 28, 2014 3:50 pm

I figured it out. Don't know why I didn't look through the mod directory itself earlier, but I recognized the problem right away. MMM has a number of .nif meshes in the standard folder meshes/creatures that are not its own, so they are overwriting the base NV .bsa's. I highlighted the specific .nifs causing the problem in screenshot below. Deleting them makes the super mutants in FNV display correctly. The FO3 super mutants are still fine as well, so I'm not sure what function these files serve. NifSkope just shows them to be the standard super mutant models.

Culprit files:

Post by TJ » Wed May 28, 2014 3:50 pm

Good find. Theoretically you could put those in MMMF3/SMSpinebreaker and change the pointers on MMM's SMs to use those. Then MMM's mutants would use those meshes and all others would use default.

Post by **Sarcasm** » Wed May 28, 2014 4:06 pm

Really? How could I do that, with FNVEdit?

I just ran around DC more and unfortunately, deleting those .nifs isn't a cure all. Rarely, I'll get a super mutant that is floating armor with no body. I only saw it twice in 15 minutes of running around Chevy Chase, Vernon Square, The Mall, and Seward Square, but I'm guessing it will become more common as I level up.

Post by **PainTrain** » Wed May 28, 2014 4:49 pm

I looked around in FNVedit, TTW has 2 nifs assigned to DC mutants under NIFZ - Model List, smspinebreakerbaredc.nif and whatever the regular model is. MMM doesn't edit every mutant so some of them are still getting through. I'm not sure why it's there but you can just replace it with a blank nif or remove that model from the list.

Post by **Sarcasm** » Wed May 28, 2014 6:02 pm

I see the smspinebreakerbaredc.nif under NIFZ - Model List, but I'm not sure how that affects the mutants. I removed it from the list but it didn't seem to change anything that I could see. How exactly does it factor in?

If I were to put the MMM smspinebreaker .nifs into a different folder like TJ suggested, what process would I use to make MMM reference them in the new folder?

Post by **Bastardo** » Sat May 31, 2014 9:00 am

Yeah I have this SM texture problem and I'm not quite sure what caused it, after staring at the Title screen about 40-50 times after disabling mods I said fuck it and just fixed it.

I did it with the GECK. Basically the NV Super Mutants are using the Fallout 3 Mutants models (which are complete), and combining them with the addons for NV Super Mutants (NV Super Mutants have base bodies with addons).

You go into all the NV Super Mutants and just disable the F3 model, and use the NV model instead. Again F3 mutants are one-piece, NV mutants are two-pieces.

I used Meansonofabitch as an example, but you get the picture. Notice how the F3 mutant only has 1 item selected, and the NV mutant needs 2. F3 model names start with "sm", NV model names start with "NV". It was annoying and tedious, and I don't remember if the NV models were there in the Data folder or if I had to extract them myself. I would just share the plugin but it's part of a much bigger patch now that has all kinds of unrelated crap. If you decide to go through with this, just remember to clean the plugin for the worldspace glitch-thing with FNV edit after you are done with Geck.

Post by **Sarcasm** » Sat May 31, 2014 11:27 pm

Hmm, that is a good fix there. Thanks for the walk-through. Since the super mutants between the games don't mix, I've just been deleting the .nifs when I want to go to NV and then restoring them when I go to DC. If I feel daring I'll try making a plugin like yours, thanks for the informations.